Her Loss is Great, But God is Greater Pt. 2 | No Sanity Story

Anne grew up dodging addiction, chaos, and a revolving door of men who called her mother’s house home. She found rides to church, worked to keep the lights on, and learned to survive without going numb at a young age. Anne never knew her biological father until one day he showed up at Snowbird. When her father showed up, sick and short on time, she discovered how powerful it is to hear a dad say, “You matter.” After his death and her mother’s overdose, Anne faced grief without regret.

Anne recounts her time hiking through the Appalachian, Pacific Crest, and Continental Divide Trails, and how the Lord used those times to grant her peace and clarity. 

Now, with her husband Hunter and their kids in Marietta, Anne is building a legacy rooted in faith, presence, and everyday grace. From miscarriage to miracles, she’s proof that ordinary faithfulness can change generations.

Her Loss is Great, But God is Greater Pt. 1 | No Sanity Story

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Chapters

• 0:00 Welcome Back And Setup
• 1:15 Anne’s Home Life And Early Faith
• 8:20 Addiction, Darkness, And Survival Mode
• 16:45 Meeting Her Biological Father
• 24:40 Calling, Mentors, And Church Support
• 31:10 Trails As Mission Field
• 41:55 Opposition, Perseverance, And Fruit
• 49:12 The Everglades Call And Mother’s Final Days
• 58:30 Grief, Assurance, And “Awake O Sleeper”
• 1:05:20 Wild Horsepacking To Clingmans Dome
• 1:16:40 Community, Memorial, And Gospel Clarity
• 1:24:10 Marriage, Moves, And Making A Home
• 1:31:20 Loss, Children, And Daily Faithfulness

Transcript

SPEAKER_01: 0:00

Hey everybody, welcome back to No Sanity Required. This week's episode will be the part two to Anne's story. If you guys haven't listened to the part one that was posted last week, so I highly suggest you guys go back and listen to that. Super cool story this week. Anne gets really personal and shares a lot about her personal life. So one, I'm just so grateful that she is comfortable and recognizes that her story will, Lord willing, be used to move people and encourage people. But I also know that that takes a lot of vulnerability and boldness. So I'm just so grateful that she was willing to do this. But you guys are in for a treat. Anne's story is just crazy. It is so wild. Um it is so crazy to just hear how faithful she stayed and just how the Lord has used her life and used sufferings and trials that she's gone through. Um so I really hope you guys enjoy. Thanks for tuning in, and welcome to No Sanity Required.

SPEAKER_00: 1:09

Welcome to No Sanity Required from the Ministry of Snowbird Wilderness Outfitters, a podcast about the Bible, culture, and stories from around the globe.

SPEAKER_06: 1:20

Um, okay, let's go. Let's just start with. I'll tell you my first memory of your mom. And we just when we were off air there, we kind of just told this, we're just gonna run this conversation back that we just had. Let's just walk right back through that. I remember you were probably 15. It was probably the second year when you came back, and you were just explaining to me the dynamic at home.

SPEAKER_04: 1:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:46

And one piece of it around that time, your mom had hooked up in a relationship with one of your teachers.

SPEAKER_02: 1:55

Yeah. Yeah, that was my senior year.

SPEAKER_06: 1:57

So that was a couple years later.

SPEAKER_02: 1:58

Yeah, it was my senior year.

SPEAKER_06: 1:59

That's the first conversation I remember. I know that prior to that I knew it was a bad situation at home, but that's the first time I like like when I remember back, I remember having a conversation with you and you were walking me through. Yep, my mom just shocking up with my with my history teacher who I found out was an alcoholic. Oh, and by the way, she didn't come to my graduation because he wasn't allowed to come.

SPEAKER_03: 2:23

And like Yeah, pretty just okay.

SPEAKER_06: 2:26

Was that the same guy where but it was previous to that prior to that, there was a guy that your mom moved into the house.

SPEAKER_03: 2:34

Yeah, my mom got yeah, when I became a believer my freshman year, right before that, my mom went on a date with a guy named Randy. And his two sons came over. I was gonna watch them. They were a couple years younger than me. Then they never moved out. And then I got over babysit, and they never moved out. Um it was really wild. And um, and then I got saved. The Lord rescued me, and then apparently I was just really obnoxious about Jesus, and it put the pressure on my mom to get married, I guess, is what she's what she would say. Yeah, that's what she said. And then she didn't get married to this guy, and it was just not a healthy situation at all. Um, he was an addict, um, and he and he there was a big strife between him and my sister. Like I said, let you know, let mentioned, you know, getting a fist fight while I was at work with my sister, who was 14. This was that guy. A grown man, yes.

SPEAKER_06: 3:24

Okay.

SPEAKER_03: 3:25

And so then it would just, you know, kind of just spiraled. And I don't know, at some point my mom had had enough, they divorced. But then shortly after that, um, that's when my mom ends up meeting, I meeting my history teacher.

SPEAKER_06: 3:38

Okay, before that, so Randy did Randy had drugs in the house.

SPEAKER_03: 3:43

Yeah, yeah, yeah. He was a he was a drug user and he was addicted to porn, and my mom lived in such a dark space. Like all I remember, I remember being real thankfully really involved in the church, and people were so gracious to come pick me up, take me to the services on Sundays and Wednesdays and all of that jazz. I and then I worked at Sonic when I finally got my car. I was working, I had school, had church. So I wasn't in the house. I tried to stay away from the house as much as possible.

SPEAKER_06: 4:10

Just go there and sleep.

SPEAKER_03: 4:11

Yes. And then um, but my mom, I mean, she would just be we lived in a small house. I think it was like 800 square feet. It was not big at all. I never saw my mom. The door was always closed. She just lived in a dark, heavy space. Um, and I mean, thinking about it, my mom was not, I mean, my mom was she had me when she was 20. So I mean, she's, I don't know, 34, 35, 36 in this time. And I'm like, now as a 40-year-old woman, I'm like, she that this is wild to me. But yeah, so I didn't see her a whole lot. And my sister, my sister desperately wanted to be seen, to have some boundaries. My mom was just drowning in her darkness, and my sister followed suit. And my sister ended up getting uh withdrawing from high school, destroying her room. It was just like this polar opposite, like the Lord was doing a new work in me, and the darkness and the heaviness was visible, um, and you could feel it in my house. Wow.

SPEAKER_06: 5:06

Um, with everybody. So your mom would stay in her room. Yeah, Brittany had would stay in her room. And where would these boys be?

SPEAKER_03: 5:13

They were oh, we had a dining room that was then converted into their space. Yep, to their space. And then my sister, all right, my mom gave birth to four daughters, and the youngest daughter named Tiffany, at in this time, she was 12. She came and met us for the first time, and then she moved in. And so you have I for some reason she thought the grass was greener on the other side. So you have five young, it will be five teenagers or preteens, and these two adults who were just, I mean, really absent and in this tiny little house. And it was it was really drugs and born running rampant. Yeah. And so it was just really, it was just grim. And and and you're kind of like, okay.

SPEAKER_06: 5:56

I just and that so that ended your mom still working at the bar.

SPEAKER_03: 6:01

Yeah, she my mom was a labor worker. She either, yeah, bartended or she laid tile, or she, I mean, she was a my mom was a hard, hard worker.

SPEAKER_06: 6:08

I knew your mom, she was tough as nails.

SPEAKER_03: 6:09

She was tough as nails.

SPEAKER_06: 6:10

Girls, girls that come out of that, oh gals that have that story, they're tough.

SPEAKER_03: 6:14

Oh, absolutely.

SPEAKER_06: 6:15

Like tough as nails.

SPEAKER_03: 6:17

Yeah. So, I mean, we're just like, okay, cool. Like, I learned a lot from my mom in that time. I mean, there's a lot of things I'm really, really grateful for. She was resourceful. But then you look back and you're like, out of necessity, you know, in like a real yeah, survival mode type of space. And so I don't know. It was, I mean, it was short. I mean, there was not really a lot of downtime between relationships for my mom. I think about the woman at the well a lot when I I think about my mom when I read that story, you know, just like survival. Um, but then this like savior complex, my mom was so hurt and so broken and felt abandoned. She did whatever she could to try and fix that for these men. But I think, but again, at the cost of, I mean, her own well-being, but then her daughters. I mean, myself and my sister really, I mean, as a grown woman looking back, and now as a mom, I have a deep compassion for my mom. You know, I remember even before having children, I was like, she's a woman first, and she is not intentionally trying to hurt me, but and she lived a sad story, but it wasn't until recently I was like, she did live a sad story. But my story, like I lived that same story, and it was really heavy, um, really sad, actually. Um and so yeah, then she ended up again, like real short time period, and then she's in a new relationship and with your teacher, with my teacher. Wow. Who just really um I mean, it's one thing to be in a relationship with your daughter's teacher, but then for the teacher, it was just not handled well at all. My mom disappeared. She went and lived like a fairy tale life with him, with him and his daughter. She was seven. So they'd like to go to the fair and she'd talk so highly about this little girl and just left you and your siblings. Yep, me and my sister at the house. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 8:10

Um Diffany was gone by the way.

SPEAKER_03: 8:12

Tiffany was gone. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 8:13

She went back.

SPEAKER_03: 8:13

Yeah, she went back. She realized the grass was not greener. This ain't what I signed up for. This is dog eat dog world. What in the world? Um, and so I remember my I had to reach out to my grandfather because the house we were living in, my gramps had purchased um for us to live in for me to have a space to stay in my whole senior, my whole high school time. Because between kindergarten and eighth grade, I think I counted, we moved 14 times, whether it was in and out of house, my going to my grandson's house, this house, I mean, 14 times. And we were not a military family. It was just unstable. And I mean, my grandfather was an interesting fellow himself, but I was I'm super grateful that he made that concerted effort to say, a little bit of stability. I'm gonna buy this house, your mom can rent it from me. And I mean, as soon as I graduated, it was sold. But I'm really thankful for that because of who knows what would have happened. And so I had the same space for all four years. Um, oh so my gramps, I remember calling my senior year and being like, Gramps, we don't have any groceries.

SPEAKER_06: 9:14

Because it was just you and Brittany living.

SPEAKER_03: 9:15

Just me and my sister. And then some of my sisters, my sister had dropped out of high school.

SPEAKER_06: 9:19

My mom's like 16, you were 17, 18.

SPEAKER_03: 9:22

And um, my mom had signed a signed to let her drop out. So my, I was yeah, telling like my my uh sister had a couple of other friends who dropped out. One of the girls had a little baby, and I remember very clearly she's giving this baby Mountain Dew in a bottle. Um, and you're like, what is going on? And so my grandps gave us some groceries and my youth pastor. Um there's like four months of backed up um electric bills, and it was really dysfunctional too, because my mom's credit was terrible. And so, like, the electric bill was in my name. You know, I remember getting mail and like, oh, I got some mail. And you're like, Oh, that's the electric bill. But so Joe, I mean the church or Joe, I don't know who, but Joe Strange made sure to get our electric bill paid off so we could have some electricity. And I mean, I so I could finish out my senior year, and um, and I remember um, yeah, like Brody had referenced the uh the story of of uh my mom not really being present for my graduation because we had gone on the senior trip and my coach Watson had been on that trip and your mom's boyfriend is one of your chaperones on your senior trip. Yeah, my mom had given him the electric bill money so he could have some cash for the I had to pay for my whole trip and he got drunk on the plane there and was pretty absent the whole time. And so there was some the school reprimanded him and told him he couldn't be a part of the graduation ceremony. I just broke my mom's heart so much that she wasn't present for my graduation. It was just a it's just a wild ride. And you know, I was telling you at lunch, I'm just even thinking about it now, like when meeting my meeting my dad, which I never thought would happen when I was 20, and then how that innate desire to be told that you're beautiful from your dad, that you mattered to your dad, it just kind of started to well up. And how the Lord met me in that space with such a kindness by leading me to the orphanage, orphanage Emmanuel for that that year. Um, the first time.

SPEAKER_06: 11:21

How long did you stay down there?

SPEAKER_03: 11:22

Well, I was only went for the trip with our trip. With your trip. Yeah, because I mean Rachel Roberts had been down there and she had been there for a little bit and we brought her home. But I just went to three days or something. Yeah, I just went for that week or two, whatever long we were. And the Lord meeting me in that space, just affirming for me, like I may never hear it from my dad verbally, but my heavenly father genuinely loves me. Like he he affirmed that in me. And when I got back from that trip, I got the news my dad had passed away and I would never hear it. And so then you like in the same sort of situation with my mom, like this longing, this longing to be cared for and to be acknowledged by my mom, you know, and she'd abandoned me, but then as I said, like she's a woman first, she's a dark life. Um, I don't know, it's just wild walking through.

SPEAKER_01: 12:08

A couple things. How was your relationship with Britney, your sister, yeah, and all this, like in high school, in the same house living polar.

SPEAKER_03: 12:18

Well, I I was the maternal figure. Okay. I was like the phoenix coming out of the the ashes sort of deal. Like, wow, you have like your life is so different than ours, and we're so proud of you. And then came really serious envy, you know, where it's like they they begrudged me.

SPEAKER_06: 12:45

Oh, you think you're better than us.

SPEAKER_03: 12:47

Yes, 100%.

SPEAKER_06: 12:48

Because you accomplished a lot, and I mean we won't have time to go into the the part of the story where you got a degree from a like amazing and reputable uh university, and then worked for a while in a career field that was crazy. Yeah. Like, you know, you're a professional at a high level. I mean, it's not just you survived, it's you thrived.

SPEAKER_01: 13:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 13:14

Vocationally, educationally, ministry, spiritually. I mean, you're not just like a success story, you're a picture of what happens when the Lord takes a person's brokenness, puts it together, and says, No, yeah, I'm not bound by man's rules here. I'm not bound by societal constructs. I do what I want to.

SPEAKER_04: 13:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 13:35

I do exactly what I want to. And when when God does that in a person's life, people are gonna hate you for it.

SPEAKER_04: 13:42

It's true.

SPEAKER_06: 13:43

And your sister's resentment of you is because of God's favor on you. It's true. And if Christians can accept that, they won't get so pissed at people hating them for being Christians. Yeah. They'll just let it go. Yeah. And they'll remember Jesus is the one that said, the world's gonna hate you because they hate me.

SPEAKER_04: 14:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 14:04

And and and sometimes I get I get confused, or maybe not confused is not the right word, but when when we are ostracized or persecuted or hated for Jesus' namesake, it's a fulfillment of a prophecy he made. And and their resentment of you came because of God's favor on you.

SPEAKER_04: 14:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 14:28

And because of your because you can't just say this is where the tension exists. It's not just, well, God's given me favor. Yes, he has, and then you've been faithful. The favor of God and the faithfulness of man in our imperfection, that's powerful, but it always brings persecution or resentment or whatever. The more you succeed, the more people you're gonna have that are gonna resent you. And when you succeed, air quotes, when you succeed spiritually and you become a strong person with constitution and emotional stability and physical strength and spiritual strength and psychological stability and all those things, people don't know what to do with that. You know, and there well, I saw it firsthand. There was a lot of resentment.

SPEAKER_04: 15:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 15:15

There really was. Um but but he didn't, I mean, that cat got didn't get to come to graduation. Because he was drinking on, he was boozing up on the senior trip.

SPEAKER_03: 15:28

Yes, and then I had to like contend with again like a different type, uh just another reminder of like the absence or abandonment, you know, the reality of that.

SPEAKER_06: 15:36

Where I'm like your mom didn't come to your graduation.

SPEAKER_03: 15:38

No, she was so she was just so grieved that he couldn't come. He couldn't come. And and so it's been interesting kind of navigating that too, where it's like kind of the sweetness of the reminder of my identity. Like the Lord has, like the Lord has bought me, like the I belong to the Lord and the abandonment stuff is very real, but then it gives a different, different perspective to my presence within my own home with my children now, you know, and and again, a compassion. There's there is a compassionate side of me when it comes to looking at my story and my mom and a gratitude for how different, I mean, how different my life is, even from the community of people around me, the resources that I have. Um, again, obviously my hope in Jesus, you know, like where am I what am I hanging my hat on? And that coming like the real life tangible expression of that. Not again, not Christianese, not because I should, but like how it's lived, you know, how it's been lived out in my life.

SPEAKER_01: 16:43

Would you say when your mom had different guys in and out of the house and you talked about like that longing for like a father figure? Yeah, would you say you like sought that in them or were you kind of like standing off? Yeah. No, I didn't never uh she had her head screwed on a ride.

SPEAKER_06: 17:01

She was tough. Anne was tough like as a 10th, 11th, 12th grader. Yeah. You're like, dang, this kid, the Lord gave you a like just a strength.

SPEAKER_03: 17:10

Yeah. Yeah, I didn't look to those guys. I thankfully and I didn't look to thankfully did not look to my male peers either. Like I was just, I mean, yeah, praise the Lord. I mean, truly, the fact that when I got married at 30, I was a virgin. Hunter and I didn't kiss each other to our wedding day. Like the Lord, I mean, just like set me apart. I'm like, I my mom had her first child when she was 14. Wow. Right. I mean, that's I have an aunt who is a great grandma and she's in her 60s. You know, you're like, you're a great grandma. You're in your 60s. I mean, start early. Like the yeah, the legacy of the of the women in my family is not was not looking really hopeful.

SPEAKER_01: 17:53

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 17:54

Again, it's like the Lord, seriously, take you from the Myri clay, put your feet on solid rock. There is a new family lineage coming out between my hunt, my my husband Hunter, and myself, like totally new branches for a new family tree. Yeah. Which I have to be really careful not to feel the pressure to, it's not my job to make that grow. But I have such resolve in me because hell or high water, we will not walk through that stuff again. I won't, I don't want to replicate it. But the Lord's like, it's not your job to do, like, I'm doing the work. Like there's a passage in Isaiah where it's like, do you not perceive it? I'm doing a new work, like bringing water to the wasteland. Like I'm and I'm like, it's true. Like the Lord is. Me getting up every morning to make breakfast for my family. That's the water, that's the river in the wasteland.

unknown: 18:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 18:50

I didn't have anybody waking me up to make me anything. I had to wake up, get us ready for school, figure out if we're gonna eat something, if there's anything to eat. I don't know. Yeah, me being present in my home and those very simple ways that people could overlook, the Lord's like, that's the new work. That is gonna impact generations. I'm doing that in you for your children, for your children's children. This is the stuff that matters. And it feels so menial, but I'm like, but it's it's it's meaningful. If I look back at my past and my mom's past and my grandmother's past, my grandmother's married like 10 times. She died in her 60s. You know, it's like, what in the world? Yeah, but the Lord's like, no, I have picked you up to put you on solid rock, and that's what I can stand on, truly. And again, it's not of my own doing. There is a there is a act of walking in obedience, but the Lord is speaking to me. He's the one that's directing my path. So yeah, it's been yeah, I'm I'm glad I did not, I I where I would have potentially put my hope in was academics. My grandfather was not a believer, um and he made a lot of money. So I have my grandfather who made a lot of money, like a$10,000 dining room table. I'm like, who cares about a dining room table? My mom who's scraping stuff together. I mean, basically doing compromising stuff to just get some food on the table. And I'm in the middle where I'm like, I don't want to pursue the riches of the world and be relationally dead, but I don't want to be over here you know, scrounging and and trying to my hardest to kind of figure things out and be emotionally erect. I'm like, Lord, where do you have me? You know, and just just the Lord being like, I was like, I'm gonna be a doctor, I'm gonna make a lot of money because I'd rather live my grandfather's life than my mom's life in some ways. But even then, like seeing when I graduated from college, the Lord, and I was gonna pursue medical school. The Lord's like, no, he put me in a put me in a family to nanny, and he spoke to me and he's like, I don't have this for you. Like I have something different. And then I end up and my life looks so different. But it was like, it's not about hanging my hat on my academic achievements to make money. Money is my security. It's like the Lord's like, I am your security. Anyhow, it's just really fascinating to look back.

SPEAKER_01: 21:14

Yeah, yeah. I also, I mean, me and Ann have only known each other for like an hour. Yeah, but I I think it's so cool seeing like, like even just hearing your story, thinking of the many things that you could have hung your head on or could have gone down that path or whatever. And it's just really cool to see like no, you you hung your head on the Lord through all of this, and the Lord has blessed that, like Brady was talking about. But I just think that's really cool and encouraging, hopefully, for our listeners to be like, man, she has pretty much been through everything you can think of, like truly crazy things. And like, I think sometimes a lot of people will be like, Well, I've been through this, so that's why I did I acted like this, or that's why I left the faith for 10 years or whatever. Yeah, and it's like so encouraging to that you're sitting here and being like, No, I've been through it all, and I still am like I know that the Lord is faithful. Like, he plucked me from the clay, put me on solid ground. I just think that's so cool, so encouraging. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 22:13

When your uh when your dad reached out, he actually just came to my house. Um, had you had never talked to him, never met him, didn't know him. So one Sunday morning, what year was that? 2010?

SPEAKER_03: 22:30

I was 20. It was 2005. It was 2005.

SPEAKER_06: 22:34

Oh, it was that early. Okay.

SPEAKER_03: 22:36

Yeah, it was 2005.

SPEAKER_06: 22:37

Oh, yeah, because I lived up McClellan Creek.

SPEAKER_03: 22:39

Yeah, and the coop was being built.

SPEAKER_06: 22:41

And he so I one Sunday morning at the end of a week of camp, in between weeks of camp, I was sitting in my re I was reading. Everybody was asleep. My kids were little. Little was about eight months pregnant with Laley, if it was oh five. Yeah. And and I remember this dude coming to my door, his face was disfigured, yeah because he had had surgery like throat cancer, which eventually killed him.

SPEAKER_03: 23:12

It did.

SPEAKER_06: 23:12

And then taking like part of his throat, his jaw was gone, and I had a hard time understanding him. But he came to my door and I went out there, and he said, I'm I'm Ann Tully's biological father, and I and somebody had given him my address.

SPEAKER_03: 23:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 23:31

Which thank God into my house.

SPEAKER_03: 23:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 23:35

And I said, Well, let's go. And I and I remember thinking, should I just run this dude off? But I knew we had talked about this. Me and you had talked about this, and I knew you you would have been mad if I'd have sent that guy away like you wanted to meet him, but not on those terms that day, kind of it's like, okay, here we are. Let's just do it. And so I I just remember going and running the bedroom and telling little, hey, Ann Tully's dad's on our porch. I'm gonna take him down there to meet her. And I'm just I said, I don't know when I'll be back. I might be gone a while. I'm I'm because I'm not gonna leave him alone, you know. And so I took him down to camp and you met your dad. I don't I mean, on a Sunday morning, a rainy Sunday morning, had no idea it was coming.

unknown: 24:15

Nope.

SPEAKER_06: 24:16

And y'all sat down and I and I went and set an earshot and eyesight, and he didn't know I was there at first, I don't think, but I just hung out there.

SPEAKER_03: 24:25

Yep.

SPEAKER_06: 24:25

And y'all talked three or four hours.

SPEAKER_03: 24:27

Yep.

SPEAKER_06: 24:27

And then he left and died a year and a half later.

SPEAKER_03: 24:30

Yeah, that was the last time I saw the first and last time I saw him. And I was like though, I yeah, I was 20 and I had it was not on my radar at all. I mean, I knew two things about my dad. He was 6'5 and his name. That was it. And then my my mom went to Indiana while I was at staff training and found him and told him that I was his daughter, and I finally got some pictures of him. I saw my very first visual of my dad in the metal building offices via an email, like a scanned picture. I was like, oh wow, and I look like my dad. And then two weeks later, I get woken up on a Sunday morning. I think Hank is the one that called me.

SPEAKER_06: 25:09

Hank Azul.

SPEAKER_03: 25:10

Yes.

SPEAKER_06: 25:11

And people here would know Hank Parker, who's on our staff. Oh, yeah, Hank Gazel. Hank Gazoo.

SPEAKER_03: 25:16

Yeah, he he woke me up and said, Brody, Brody met your dad and he's kind or whatever. And I'm like, what in the world? Like it was not on my radar at all. It just showed up. So he pulled up in his red Dodge Dakota, put my hand through the passenger window, shake, I shook his hand. I'm like, you must be Eric. I'm Ann. Nice to meet you. We sat and I was in a big old bowl of lucky charms because we had the cereal and the dispensers, you know, that's what we would eat sometimes. And yeah, I just sat. It was the week before Father's Day. I remember that on the bottom part of the coop, rainy and and just talking, like you said, it was really hard to understand him. Um, but I was hanging on every word, taking it in. And then after he left, I was so confused. I was like, this is I'm not even sure I want, like, did I want this? You know, it was so strange. Because I just lived life without knowing my dad. And the curiosity of him was there, but now he's here. And what do I do with that? What do I make sense of? And that's when I said, like, you know, that stirring in me to hear him affirm me. I'm like, this guy is a stranger, but it's like evidence of the way that we're created, you know, like and and and like the importance of healthy familial roles, a mother and a father living together, unified, and raising their children with their love as the unified front, you know, like it's affirming there's like something in us the way God has created us, that that's it's a good, beneficial thing. And when it's messed with, man, it can really mess people up. And so I'm like contending with this, and then my dad's family, I would get the Lord would affirm it like he has a bigger purpose. And it's not even just about me. I'm a that may have done something really important for my dad that I will never know. I mean, he drove all the way from Indiana on a random Sunday. It mattered to him somewhat, you know. So anyway, just this reminder that it's not just about your insular experience, but like we're all connected and I don't know what God's doing. And he's totally comfortable with me coming to him, trying to make sense of it, but then also just kind of coming to terms with I don't know the inner workings of everything. And that may not have been even been about me. It could have been about something for him or his family, because I would get letters randomly during the summer from like his aunt just welcoming me to the family when I'd be like, What in the world am I doing? Why did and it's like we welcome to the family. I'm like, okay, Lord, thank you for that affirmation that this wasn't some random thing that now I have to work through, but it had there's purpose to it. So yeah, it was really wild. I mean, crazy, really wild.

SPEAKER_06: 27:54

I mean, I've had a lot of crazy things happen in my life and ministry, especially. And that's I mean, that's on the list at the top of the list. It's crazy. And that dude showed up on my porch.

SPEAKER_01: 28:03

Yeah. Well, also, they told me earlier that uh this guy calls Brody and is like, hey, would there be a time I can meet with you? I'm Ann's biological father or whatever. And Brody's like, Yeah, man, just come to my house. Shows up 15 minutes later.

SPEAKER_06: 28:20

Yeah, I'm thinking, like, we'll plan a time. No, he just shows up, which is crazy.

SPEAKER_01: 28:25

It's already in town. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 28:26

But I wasn't about to tell him where she I knew he couldn't find her. I knew he couldn't find her because you're at camp. There's one address to all those buildings, and you come to my house, and my man showed up.

SPEAKER_01: 28:38

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 28:39

Showed up. I was like, oh, okay, brother.

SPEAKER_01: 28:42

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 28:43

Yeah, let's go down.

SPEAKER_05: 28:44

Let's go.

SPEAKER_01: 28:45

Crazy.

SPEAKER_06: 28:46

But then I mean, y'all talk I three, four hours at my stay, I didn't go anywhere. And yeah, I remember I was like, Dang, oh, I'm hungry. But I don't know. And I remember like, it sounds like everything's okay down there, and I'm gonna slip down the metal building, get me a little Debbie. Went in there and got me something to eat, snook back up.

SPEAKER_04: 29:08

That's funny. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 29:09

Man, it's crazy. Um the last thing then uh that was in 05. He died in 06, and then your mom died about nine years later.

SPEAKER_03: 29:21

Um, she died in 2012, November 9th of 2012.

SPEAKER_06: 29:24

It was 2012. Oh wow, I thought it was 2015. No, okay, it was 2012. And so it was closer together than I realized six years later, and she's 48.

SPEAKER_03: 29:36

Yep, she was 48. And uh just really crazy because I'm 40. I'm like, oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_06: 29:41

Yeah, it's weird when you it's weird when you get so I'll be next year I'll be my dad's age. Yeah. You remember when my dad died, and I'll be his age next next year that he was when he died. And one thing, Ann, I want to say before we the last thing I want to do is I want to cover your mom's story. Uh the story of how your mom passed and the way that all. Went down. And then I won't celebrate where God's got you now.

SPEAKER_04: 30:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 30:04

I mean you're flourishing, you know? Yeah. Like I said, you're not surviving, you're thriving.

SPEAKER_04: 30:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 30:10

And and you did there's so many things we're not touching on. You did some cool things. Yeah. But we got to touch on your hawking career. Sure. But then also, I mean, you moved to Montana and worked. What was that thing you worked in Montana? I didn't know I did. Nursing home or something?

SPEAKER_03: 30:25

Oh, Wyoming. The mental health hospital.

SPEAKER_06: 30:27

You worked at a mental health hospital in Wyoming.

SPEAKER_03: 30:30

State Mental Health Hospital.

SPEAKER_06: 30:32

And worked at the state mental institution in Wyoming. And then somewhere near.

SPEAKER_03: 30:37

Let me tell you, let me tell you, listen, listen, well, my mom, we had my 92 niece on stanza. We called her Stangela and had it packed to the brim. My mom drove with me from Savannah.

SPEAKER_06: 30:50

Is that 09?

SPEAKER_03: 30:51

That was in 10? No, it was 07. Okay. It was 07, I believe.

SPEAKER_06: 30:58

After summer?

SPEAKER_03: 31:00

Yeah, it was the fall. We drove to Wyoming. Yeah, to Wyoming. Stangela. And Stanela. 92 Nissan Stanza. Go look it up. It's not an impressive car. I love that car.

SPEAKER_06: 31:10

Rob had one. Okay. There we go.

SPEAKER_03: 31:12

There you go. So we're going, we're going. And I'm getting um going through orientation and things like that. I start having groups, you know, where I'm seeing these. There's it's an on-campus facility. So you have like inpatient facility. They had a criminal justice facility, which was, I was gonna say, you know, whacking. People ain't just crazy, they'll kill you. And they, yes, they will. And then I had the um extended psych services, and that's the population I I worked with, but they lived there on campus. A lot of them did. Anyway, I remember where my facility I stayed on campus, and where the walkway for the for the people who live there, they were the patients, they'll walk off to go because they couldn't smoke on campus. They had to go right outside the fence. Well, my walkway to my place I stayed was right there. So I was interfacing with these people, which are awesome. They're people first, but they also have mental health, you know, uh diagnoses. So I remember my mom was a smoker. So she, when she was there with me for a couple of days, she'd be on the at the wall smoking with these people, telling them all kinds of stuff about me. So I'd be in group, like facilitating a group, and they're telling me stuff about my life. Oh my goodness. I'm like, mom, you cannot tell them. And one guy called me George Ann. He'd he'd walk by, he's like, hey, George Ann. And I'm like, hey, whatever. And they they throw random facts out. I'm like, you've got to stop telling people my personal information, mom. Like, these are not your, these are not your. This is a professional setting for me. This is not a person.

SPEAKER_06: 32:49

I went to four years at a university to have this job.

SPEAKER_03: 32:53

Yes. So I was just, I mean, but that was my mom's personality. She loved people, she loved being around people. She was easy to be around. She was. I she was just fun. I mean, I I think, yeah, she was very likable. And I, when I think about my mom, I just had there is a sweetness and a fondness. I don't remember her as an angry person. She could have been really angry. She was, and she was just really enjoyable to be around. Like I think all the all my friends just really enjoyed being around her because she was easy to be around. She just she loved people. She really did love people, and she didn't care. There was like whether you made a ton of money or no money, whether you were crazy or not. She was gonna friend you and show you that she cared because she really did care. And I admire that about my mom for sure. But I I remember like, mom, stop it. Stop telling them about me.

SPEAKER_06: 33:45

Anyway, but you didn't stay out there long.

SPEAKER_03: 33:47

No, I wasn't out there very long. I was out there for maybe yeah, a semester, six months, and and then I came back.

SPEAKER_06: 33:56

You came back and took a a front office job.

SPEAKER_03: 33:58

Oh, yeah. Well then I hiked the AT. And then yes, I worked in the office. Yeah, I guess I worked in the office when I got back from the AT. Yeah, yep, yep. Did that for a little bit and then um tried to do an old school semester, but then no kids signed up with Mark Manning. Yep, yeah. I was like, I want to do this, but then no one signed up. So then it was postponed. Then I ended up getting um oh, and then oh, I went to Peru. I lived in Peru. Yeah, I did with the IMB. Yeah, I went to Kansas City. That was a very spontaneous thing. I feel like a movie needs to be made.

SPEAKER_01: 34:34

Like I need a documentary style movie of your life.

SPEAKER_03: 34:38

Because I was what I wanted to do old school and then no one signed up, and then I got this random call because LJ had told somebody they called and said, Hey, our semester's already started, but would you want to come and be a leader? And I'm like, what? And it was it was a it was a one of the most spur-of-the-moment decisions. So I moved loaded up Stangila and then drove.

SPEAKER_06: 34:56

Was Scott who was in charge of that?

SPEAKER_03: 34:58

Who yeah, Scott Bronner? But and Sean, uh Sean Brantgum. He was and so then um four and a half months in Kansas City, and then my crew went to Peru and shared the gospel um in the jungles and on the coast. We did eat coy, yeah, guinea pigs. Yep.

SPEAKER_06: 35:14

And uh I don't remember if it was a letter from you or where we had a it was back then it was hard to talk on the phone, but I remember you're like, Well, guinea pig ain't bad.

SPEAKER_03: 35:24

Yeah, yep. And so then that was a great experience. It came back and then it was um then that's when I led old school. No, no, no. What oh, and then I worked.

SPEAKER_06: 35:35

When when did you through hawk the next time?

SPEAKER_03: 35:38

The PCT in 2012, but I'm trying to figure out oh, I was trying to decide if I was gonna go do if I was gonna do a second year of fusion or if I was gonna stay here and work. And I stayed here to work. I I remember having a conversation at your house off of McClellan Creek outside, and I do believe I was probably supposed to go back to fusion, and I made a decision because of a dude sitting around the fire that I Yeah, I remember that. And that was I thought he was gonna stay, and he didn't. And I stayed.

SPEAKER_06: 36:10

Don't stay for a boy.

SPEAKER_03: 36:12

Nope. And the Lord redeems all things, but I remember serving the Lord, doing his thing. Yes, yeah, but it but it's like I don't remember, but again, so then I'm here and uh felt like the Lord was stirring in me because I had just started like really getting in the word and like I had unfinished business from the from the AT, like sharing the gospel. I mean, like AT hiker, the hiker community was my people group. I mean, I love it's just a level playing field. And um, so I remember my back was out and I was sitting, I was in your office, I was doing work, but I had to lay on the ground and like put my legs up and like type on the computer, and I'm having a conversation in your office because I was like, I think I'm gonna go do the PCT, but I can't even walk. But I'm like, I'm gonna do the PCT and it was like your blessing or whatever. And we've talked through it a little bit, and you asked me, like, why not do the AT again?

SPEAKER_06: 37:00

or Because I didn't understand the hawking world. Yeah, it is a world, it is a world explaining that to me.

SPEAKER_03: 37:07

Yeah, and it's like, you know, if uh because they say you don't do two hikes, you do one or three. And I'm like, I have unfinished business, and if I get to, if I go do the PCT, I feel like the Lord will either affirm for me this is what I have for you, or he's gonna say, Oh, no, no, no, like don't do that. The PCT was a very lonely hike for me, but personally, spiritually, it was the richest. The word of God came to life because I didn't have other distractions. It was incredible. I mean, it was a war. I mean, it was there's so much to say about it. Anyhow, the Lord affirmed, like, that's go do the CDT. Because I was like, uh how I'll have rapport with people with the hiking community. I do all three. I'm a triple crowner. It's a very small number of people. I was one of the first 250 people to do the triple crown, and I was like, that gives me a foot in to actually connect with people.

SPEAKER_06: 37:58

What the the AT is 2200?

SPEAKER_03: 38:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 38:02

The PCT is 2600.

SPEAKER_03: 38:04

Yep.

SPEAKER_06: 38:05

What is the Continental Divide Trail?

SPEAKER_03: 38:07

30, 3100.

SPEAKER_06: 38:08

And it's the one that runs through Colorado.

SPEAKER_03: 38:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 38:11

Runs Canada to Mexico.

SPEAKER_03: 38:12

Yes, it's intense. That's crazy. Yeah, it's intense. I did all three. It is all day.

SPEAKER_06: 38:20

You remember me telling you that story about when I was section hiking with Eric Bath and that guy committed suicide?

SPEAKER_05: 38:26

Oh.

SPEAKER_06: 38:27

Remember this? So the the reason I bring it up is it's such a ministry. Well, you get out there and you realize a bunch of people out here soul searching. Absolutely. I went I hiked one little section with Eric Bath. When Eric through hiked, he came when he came through here, and I've done this with several people, several males.

SPEAKER_02: 38:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 38:46

And I jumped on the trail with him at Fontana Dam, I think, and did the 70 miles through the smokies.

SPEAKER_04: 38:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 38:54

And I think Little met us at Newfound Gap, and we got some food or whatever, and and we'd done two days to get to there, and then we did, you know, then we went to Davenport Gap and we were we were camping in Davenport Gap. We're staying at a shelter somewhere through there, and I had walked with this guy all day, and his he caught his call sign or trail his trail name was the general.

SPEAKER_04: 39:16

Okay.

SPEAKER_06: 39:16

And he was like 38 years old. He was a courier in Washington, D.C. Yeah. From high school. He had gotten a job being a courier, and that's all he'd ever done. 38, having an early midlife crisis, very existential crisis, and didn't just didn't, what's the meaning of life? And he was out there through hiking. And I shared the gospel with him while we walked, and we sat that evening and ate our mountain house or our ramen or whatever. And we had a long conversation. Several other guys around, but me and him ended up off to the side talking. He broke, he wept, he said, I need Jesus.

SPEAKER_04: 39:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 39:53

And then he said, Not not now.

SPEAKER_04: 40:02

Wow.

SPEAKER_06: 40:03

Because I thought, I remember thinking, you know, when you're when you're in Christ, when you've done ministry and you've led people to Christ, I guess that's the best way to word it. You know, in student ministry, we see it happen where a kid receives Christ, right? And you can watch them taking those final steps. You're like, oh, this is getting ready to happen. Yeah. This is I'm getting ready to watch regeneration occur. I felt that with that guy. I'm like, where this is happening.

SPEAKER_04: 40:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 40:27

And he got to a point where he said, Man, I need to sleep on this. I want I we're gonna we're gonna be walking together all day tomorrow. I need to think about this. And then at night we slept, went to bed. Uh his shelter was kind of packed, or six or eight people slammed in there. It was real cold.

SPEAKER_04: 40:43

It was yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 40:44

And the next day we hiked and and he was still pretty open, but that moment had passed. And uh about two weeks later, he got to um he got to Damascus, Virginia, uh-huh, jumped off the trail, and killed himself in a motel. And it's it's that story is what motivates my urgency for the gospel. Absolutely. It's like to see someone get that close and and then not but I bring that up to say you're not just out there vacation hiking.

SPEAKER_03: 41:13

Oh, no, no, no.

SPEAKER_06: 41:13

There's ministry out there like there's ministry nowhere.

SPEAKER_03: 41:16

Oh, absolutely. Well, because again, like all the distractions, everything is taken away. It's a level playing field. You're walking the same terrain in the same weather, but you know, bearing the same load and and and just moving forward. Like the goal is the same to get to the northern terminus, but the process, I mean, it's real personal and um you connect very quickly with people. And that on the PCT in particular, the Lord was like, you do not have to reference scripture for it to be valid. You have honest and authentic conversation with people and you share the word and it will not go void. And it you talked about like feeling like out of persecuted or or ridiculed or mocked or whatever. And it was like, yeah, the I mean, it was so interesting some of the false accusations that came about, like with me, and like really ridiculous things like Anne likes to get drunk and have sex with people, which is the farthest thing from the truth, right? But people were trying to rile me up because they knew that I loved Jesus, but also it wasn't it would it wasn't it was it's authentic to who I am. Like I want to hear your story, and anytime there's opportunity for me to share my story, which is my as a God's story, then I would share it. But like out of a genuine desire to connect, not out of a task. I'm out here to evangelize, check. I shared the Romans Road, check. No, it was like sharing life with these people because that there's power in that. And so, but because of it, I did have some very legit opposition. And the Lord's just reminding me like you walk faithfully, like I it's not my job to defend myself. I live faithfully. The Lord goes before me and share the truth and and don't be weird about it. Like, don't be weird about it. Um, and and it's really incredible because I have since, I mean, there were no like I didn't walk anyone to, you know, the sinner's prayer while I was on the trail, but I still am deeply connected with the people that I hiked with. And since then, I did have a guy named Dada. He called me and he um the CDT, I hiked with him, and he was always trying to walk me into controversial conversations. And uh, I could just, you know, I pr I knew what he was doing. And I would humor him a little bit, but also not follow for the trap. But he called me like two years later and he he thanked me for being so faithful and being true, and he had given his life to the Lord, which was incredible. Wow, you know, and I'm like, thank you, Lord. Like again, if my eyes are fixed on Jesus, then I can navigate that opposition. If my eyes are fixed on gaining the favor of man, that would have screwed me up big time when I was hiking. Because some of the stuff that was said about me, I was like, this is really kind of unnerving. But the Lord's been like, you just walk faithfully.

SPEAKER_06: 43:56

He had me out there to connect with people, and so what year was the CDC?

SPEAKER_01: 44:02

CDT was uh um 2014. Yep. I was about to say, I told you earlier that my dad section hikes the AT. And I went on like a few sections with him when I was younger, and this is a funny story, but we finished I think we it was like a long weekend for me. I was in middle school, I was like in sixth grade. So I went with my dad all weekend. It was like in maybe October or November, so kind of cold. Yeah, and then my mom's supposed to pick us up somewhere, probably around this area, like a windy mountain, yeah. At a at a trailhead, she's supposed to pick us up, and I don't know what happened. She is lost in the mountains, like on these back roads. So, like, she's supposed to pick us up at like two or something. At this point, it's like 5 p.m. The sun is going down, she's nowhere to be seen. I'm freezing cold, like 12-year-old me. I'm like just wanting all I wanted was chocolate milk. That's all I can remember. All weekend I've been in the woods with my dad. It was fun, but I was done. And my mom is not coming, and I'm starting to freak out a little bit. I'm like, all right, joke's over. What is this? And so eventually my mom actually had to call like the park rangers and they had to come and find us. But I remember I was a trooper the whole time, and I remember my dad saw this young lady who was just like hiking, yeah, not the AT, just like hiking a trail. And I think he freaked her out. But he was like, Hey, can I use your phone? She probably thought she was about to get like kidnapped or something. She was like, No, thank you, and like walked away. And so I saw that happen and just started to weep. I was like, We're stuck here. Like, and I think my dad panicked, and all he started to do is start singing, I am a C, I am a C H. I am a C H and I remember sitting there, like wasn't helping. Yeah, kept crying. I was like, I'm never doing this again.

SPEAKER_06: 45:49

Oh, I don't know how you probably come that night, or y'all spend that out there.

SPEAKER_01: 45:55

No, late that night, a park ranger came. Oh, the ranger came, gotcha. Yeah. And I got my chocolate milk, don't worry. It pinned out at the end.

SPEAKER_06: 46:05

But so a couple contrasting stories.

SPEAKER_01: 46:09

I'm like, I don't know how you did that. I was out there for two and a half days.

SPEAKER_06: 46:13

But I remember flying hot because you were coming through here. You might have been up around Warrior or Waya.

SPEAKER_04: 46:20

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_06: 46:21

They call it around here, they call it Warrior. But and you, it was when Rachel was still with you on the first hike on the AT at the first part of the and some dudes wanted to play naked checkers or something.

SPEAKER_03: 46:33

I forgot about that. They sure did. You told me I was like, they sure did. Yeah, yes.

SPEAKER_06: 46:40

They were just I forgot about that.

SPEAKER_03: 46:42

Oh, yeah.

unknown: 46:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 46:45

You do. And it helps if you're the weirdo. Yeah, we were in the shelter. And these dudes, y'all were gonna play. Yes, it was actually, yes, it was in, yeah, yeah. It was, yeah. I remember game, it was in Georgia.

SPEAKER_06: 46:56

So it was early on the trail. It was very early on. Y'all haven't been hocking but a few days.

SPEAKER_03: 47:00

No, it's true. And these dudes that is hilarious.

SPEAKER_06: 47:04

And you didn't have your glasses or contacts. You said it was all just real blurry.

SPEAKER_03: 47:08

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 47:10

The Lord protected me. That's hilarious. These guys took their clothes off.

SPEAKER_03: 47:15

Yes, they did. We were on a two-level shelter. That's exactly what it was. And Rachel and I were on the bottom level. They were on the top level. I was sleeping. I had glasses. I hadn't had LASIK at that point. I had my glasses off next to my sleeping bag. And I think they woke us up and they said, Hey, do y'all want to hang out? That's so stupid. Y'all want to hang out? We're like, okay, so we go we got to climb, climb the ladder. And you're like, oh, naked. They were totally naked. What in the world?

SPEAKER_06: 47:44

You were weirdos out there.

SPEAKER_03: 47:46

So I climbed back down. I was like, I'm going to sleep.

SPEAKER_06: 47:49

You told me a week or two later, but they were maybe section hocking. You're like, yes, they were.

SPEAKER_03: 47:55

I didn't, I mean, I didn't see them again. I didn't see them again, but so oh my gosh. Stuff you remembered.

SPEAKER_06: 48:01

Yeah. Yeah. Oh, I'll never forget that. When you when you finally did get back here and you went to to work in the old school program, which is no longer, we no longer run that here.

SPEAKER_03: 48:14

R I P. R. I P.

SPEAKER_06: 48:15

Yep. Yep. It gave way to the Snowbird Leadership Institute, which is alive and well, but the old school program was special.

SPEAKER_01: 48:21

It was special.

SPEAKER_06: 48:22

While we're mourning one thing, we're we're celebrating new life. But uh but the old school program was so cool. It was really, yeah. And it was a semester spent in in the wilderness, basically. Yeah. And you were leading a trip. 2012.

SPEAKER_03: 48:39

You yeah, that's your now husband Hunter.

SPEAKER_06: 48:43

Yeah. Y'all were not dating.

SPEAKER_03: 48:44

No, we weren't. I had the I had my eyes on him, but he was a slow burn.

SPEAKER_06: 48:48

He still is. He is slow. I don't know. We're in a hurry.

SPEAKER_03: 48:52

He's a hard worker, but he's not easily excitable.

SPEAKER_06: 48:55

That's exactly what you needed. And uh, and then blue Barry Worth. Blue was on y'all were the four uh guides, y'all the four proctors, y'all were guiding that trip, and we would do a section of that semester paddling sea cacks in the Everglades.

SPEAKER_03: 49:09

Yep.

unknown: 49:09

Yep.

SPEAKER_06: 49:10

I found out your mom had had passed.

SPEAKER_03: 49:13

Yeah, you had found out that she was in critical condition. Initially.

SPEAKER_06: 49:16

Initially the call was she was hospitalized in critical condition. She had eaten a bottle of Tylenol.

SPEAKER_03: 49:22

Yep. Yeah, she had a pretty, pretty heavy life. And so out of desperation.

SPEAKER_06: 49:27

She was committed to doing what she did that night.

SPEAKER_03: 49:29

Yep.

SPEAKER_06: 49:29

Just a dark things had come to a head for her.

SPEAKER_03: 49:33

Yeah, they had. And I was unaware of that, right?

SPEAKER_06: 49:37

So you're out in the Everglades.

SPEAKER_03: 49:38

I'm in the Everglades. That was a Tuesday. My mom found herself in a dark situation where she had overdosed on Tylenol and it and um slowly started shutting down her organs. And then she was it just took a little while for the people in her life to um get her the care that she needed. Wednesday morning, apparently, she was dropped off at a friend's house by this um lame boyfriend of hers.

SPEAKER_06: 50:04

Um loser and an abuser and a wicked evil person.

SPEAKER_03: 50:11

Yes, wicked evil person. Absolutely. Dropped her off. She couldn't get warm enough, from my understanding. So then her friend then called um 911, got her to the hospital. That was on a Wednesday. And then they ended up life flighting her on Thursday from Savannah to Atlanta, which was a grace from God for my sister, because my sister and my mom were at odds, because my mom had just made some really terrible decisions with relationships, and it was really big strife and a heaviness for my sister. She just could not talk to my mom, which is in abusive relationships, which I supported. Um, I still continued to be in communication with my mom. Um, the Lord had given me the ability to hold boundaries with her, um, to be present, to be available, but to hold boundaries, not to feel manipulated by my mom, to accommodate her. Um, again, strength from the Lord, purpose from the Lord. And so when my mom was life flighted to Atlanta and that that Thursday, my sister was living in the Atlanta area at that time. So she was able to go and be with my mom while she was still coherent. Again, I'm oblivious to all of this because we're in the Everglades leading the old school program. And then on Friday is when I was notified the park rangers found me in the water and had told me that there was a family emergency I needed to go with them.

SPEAKER_06: 51:22

We had, we had, we had, we knew where like the trip would be mapped. We knew the area they would be on that day. So we communicated with the park service. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 51:35

Yeah. And so we were in the kayaks and they said, Are you Ann Tully? I was like, uh that's me. And they said, You can't come with us. And so I didn't know any details. Um, I didn't want to know any details, like I'd mentioned. I just didn't, you know, partial information would not have served me well. And I Lord was just, again, very gracious to help guard my mind and that space. There was like, I don't know, I think there was a good number of hours, anywhere between two to four hours where I sat by myself um on the shore with my journal. And actually, I probably should go open that journal. I've done it a couple of times, just like God in the word and just prayed because I knew that my life was going to be changed. I didn't know how. Like this, if someone's pulling me out of the water for a family emergency, I knew it was a big deal. And so I just sat there and journaled and prayed and waited. Didn't speculate. I wasn't going to allow fear to like grip my he my heart. Again, the work of the spirit in me, because that yeah, it's just a something bigger than myself. And um, and then uh youth pastor and his wife came and got me.

SPEAKER_06: 52:36

We called them. They we knew they were pretty close and they're really close to our ministry.

SPEAKER_03: 52:41

Yep.

SPEAKER_06: 52:41

And I knew they wouldn't bat an eye.

SPEAKER_03: 52:42

They'd Yeah, and they didn't. They came down and got in the car, and that's when I they called Brody, and that's when I was uh first informed like my mom was in the hospital and uh in critical condition, like she was in a medical, medically induced coma. And I was like, She's still alive. And Brody was just like, it's it's grim, it does not look favorable. And so which I I was thankful that she was still alive, but also not this false sense of hope that she was in a space state that she would recover. And she and I guess because she had admitted that it was a suicide attempt, um, she was not um eligible for any type of um transplant. And so it was just a matter of of time then or everything just started to shut down. And by the time I arrived, Tanya flew with me, which again was just I was so thankful, and um landed and I got on the phone with Brody and he asked if I well, you had asked before then if I wanted someone from my family or for someone from Snowbird to pick me up, and I opted for the the latter. So my friend Wallace came and picked me up and got on the phone and uh we were leaving the airport, and that's when you said your mom has passed, and and again, the work of the Lord. I said the words that came out of my mouth were I loved her well and I have no regrets. That's that is that is Jesus. That is Jesus. I had said everything, because I remember the summer before um Spencer had preached uh during staff um a breakout about hell. I left that breakout. I was, I have never been so heavy laden for anybody, ever. I remember walking a Healy Field one morning, I called my mom. I was like, I need to make sure she has heard the gospel. And I walked that road for 45 minutes. I mean, with a with a passion and a conviction. I was like, I gotta tell, I mean, we got we gotta talk about this mom, you know. And and at the end she's like, thank you, you know, sort of deal. But I was like, and I prayed. I mean, I grieved my mom's death before I actually got the news because it was real, like when she's passed, the waitiness of where she's gonna spend eternity, like that's already been established. And it was the first time it was like, no, no, this matters, and it matters now. The urgency is now. And the Lord, it wasn't self-induced, it was spirit provoked. Um, and and I that and I'm thankful because then at the end of the day, I did. I loved her well, and I have no regret. There's nothing I there's nothing left to say to my mom, right? Which is okay because I there I couldn't say it. So thankfully I have not been gripped by that grief. But like I was telling you guys on the PCT, the Lord just being so kind, even though it was heavy, it was so heavy. But walking in the Sierra Nevadas of the PCT, grieving my mom's death, they came out of it just felt like nowhere for a whole week, like walking and crying, grieving, and just being like, get it together, Ann, she's still alive, you know. But little did I realize, I mean, a matter of months later, she would be gone.

SPEAKER_06: 55:40

And I'm yeah, and I'll tell you this uh as just as a genuine encouragement because we mentioned earlier, I appreciated the way when we were talking about we're gonna because she had no church, no family, no like who's gonna memorialize her? Yeah, words need to be said when a person passes from this life. There's I feel like there's a sense of something needs to be said.

SPEAKER_04: 56:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 56:08

And there needs to be reflection. I think, I think weddings, like I think births of children, weddings and and deaths, funerals, memorial service, whatever, funerals, passings. Those three things, everyone in that sphere needs to pause. Yeah, these are monumental. Uh uh, the birth of a child is monumental, yeah. Um the the the joining and marital union of two people is monumental.

SPEAKER_04: 56:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 56:34

And the passing of someone from from this life to through the doors of death is monumental.

unknown: 56:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 56:39

And I remember having this conversation saying we we're gonna do this, we need to do this, and and we talked about, I don't remember the words exactly, but you I I wasn't, I felt like she probably wasn't born again, and you just saying, I don't, I really don't know exactly what my mom's spiritual because she would Tamra would say she was a good good with God. I'm a Christian, I'm good with God.

SPEAKER_05: 57:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 57:03

And so you always I always want to be like, okay, well then who am I? I did I didn't maybe I didn't see fruit, or we never unpacked really good gospel conversation, but I'm not gonna get up there and assume that she's not with the Lord, but I'm also not gonna preach her into heaven. Yes. And remember, we were having that conversation. You're like, no, I want you to just give people there the gospel.

SPEAKER_04: 57:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 57:23

And most of the people there were our people, but then you had you had some family members there that reject the gospel.

SPEAKER_03: 57:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 57:29

And that was an intense yeah. That was an intense thing.

SPEAKER_03: 57:32

Well, it was interesting too, right? Because like I had felt the weightiness of eternity before she had died, had come to terms with, I mean, I shared the gospel. She died, it's done. I don't know if she's in heaven or not. I was really turned off by the people in my family who were like, she's in a better place. I'm like, whatever that means. Like, what do you like? What are you talking about? Like, there's no consolation. I don't feel comforted by that. Feels really kind of superficial and weak. It's like a Hail Mary sort of deal. Like, let me try and make myself feel better. And I was just rejecting, I rejected that, but it was really, really cool. So that was November of 2012. My mom died. I'm on the CDT in 2014, the beginning of the trail. I'm in New Mexico. I'm walking and I'm grieved. It's the first time I'm like, I I called my mom on the AT, I almost quit at mile 137. I I was like, what am I doing here? I walking through snow, I don't know even what I'm doing. And she said, You got this, Ann. Like she she gave me a vote of confidence when Rachel Rachel Roberts was like, You can quit.

SPEAKER_06: 58:33

Um she was ready to quit. She was ready to quit. And she did.

SPEAKER_03: 58:37

And she did. No shade throwing her away. No, she walked a lot of miles. And I'm glad she's gonna go. I would have quit. I would not throw in shade.

SPEAKER_06: 58:45

I'm gonna I'd have quit at the end.

SPEAKER_03: 58:46

He wouldn't even throw it.

unknown: 58:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 58:48

So, but and so then, but my mom's like, you got this. And I'm you know, in in light of all of the rest of the story of like feeling pretty abandoned, it's like again, that innate desire to be affirmed by your parents. And my mom believed in me when I was having a hard time. And I I look back at that mile marker 137 and how different my life is because I decided to keep going. My mom's like, You got this. And I was like, I do, I got this. I called her on the PCT towards the very end because I had to get back for old school. And I'm like, I'm on a timeline. I can't hike any harder, but I don't want to not finish. And she's like, You got this. And I I did, I finished, finished and got it done and was here to start the semester. And again, like hearing my mom just cheer me on. I'm on the CDT knowing I cannot hear my, I can't call my mom, which I wouldn't say my mom was my person. Like, you know, some people like my mom's my person, I'll call her for everything. That was my mom was not my confidant, but there's something in me where I was like, my mom was very proud of me. For I mean, she was really she was proud of me. And I cared, I was like, what is going on? What is going on? And carried that weight and finally was able to identify it where I was like, I just need to grieve this. But then I was walking through the Gila of New Mexico. I no lie, no exaggeration. I forded this river a hundred times that day, back and forth, back and forth, back and forth. And I had My iPod, um, not my cell phone. I had an actual iPod that I was listening to occasionally, and um, I had my had my one earbud in, and there's a song by David Crowder. It's like the the words are like awake oh sleeper. And I'm listening to it, and I again just hearing from the Lord. The Lord said to me, I said that to your mom. I said, awake oh sleeper to your mom. And it was an affirmation in my spirit, not because I was looking for it, not because I was conjuring it up, but the Lord said, I said, awake, oh sleeper. And I'm like, my mom, I really believe there was such a grace from when that dark moment in her life on that Tuesday she took that Tylenol to being coherent for two days, sitting with it, knowing that she's dying, talking to my sister, knowing she can't touch base with me. Like I'm she tried, she called, left me three messages. There was a confrontation for her because she had heard the gospel, she had seen my life, the faithfulness of God in my life. And I really, the Lord, I am my ever being affirmed for me that He she knew she knew the truth, and I really do believe that she is in heaven with the Lord. And I am so thankful for that. And so it was really cool, like this full circle moment where I was like, I couldn't call my mom, but the Lord said, I called on your mom and she's with me. And so it made the rest of my hike was uh it was that was two years after she died.

SPEAKER_06: 1:01:36

Two years after she died. That's the Lord spoke that to you. Yeah, that's so powerful. It's did you ever see the thief on the cross thing that Alistair Begg did?

SPEAKER_03: 1:01:43

Uh uh, I don't think so.

SPEAKER_06: 1:01:45

Cause I he always like like uh those types of conversions or confessions that take place in the midnight hour of a person's life. You know, the thief on the cross is the example of that happening in scripture. And you know, Alistair Begg's like that dude never got discipled, he didn't get baptized. He's like, he gets and he's acting it out and he's so funny. And he's speaking at this conference and everybody's in suits. You saw it, didn't you? I th I showed it at uh Red Oak one time when I was teaching, but he said, he said, uh he's talking about the importance of discipleship, but that some people like like they're gonna come to faith in Jesus at a point in time where maybe there's not much time.

SPEAKER_04: 1:02:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:02:27

And uh you see, can you imagine the thief on the cross he gets to heaven, he's standing there, angel comes over and is like, okay, what uh what was the date of your conversion, you know, whatever? Like what um and then were you baptized? He's talking about the things we put emphasis on. Yes, and he's like qualifiers. Okay, uh, what about uh the doc what's your view on the doctrine of justification by faith? Then the guy goes, I never heard of it before in my life. I don't even know what you're talking about. And he's like, Okay, oh, oh, you never heard of it. Hold on. I'm gonna need to go get a supervisor. And he goes, gets a supervisor angel, brings him back over there, and the guy's like, oh yeah, he's acting this thing out. And he's and these pastors are behind Aleister Begg and they're like scowling, you know. And he's like, Yes, supervisor angel. And he's like, What about what about the doctrine of the atonement? Do you know? And he's like, Well, systematic theology. I have no idea what any words mean. He's like, Well, then what by what grounds are you standing here? He said, Because the guy on the middle cross told me I could come. And it's like the coolest to me. It's like the guy on the middle cross, what he says, that's what goes.

SPEAKER_04: 1:03:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:03:28

And it was that, you know, in that window of time, the guy on the middle cross told Tamar she could come.

SPEAKER_03: 1:03:35

Uh, yeah. Yes. Pretty that preaches. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:03:38

Yeah. Because there's a whole bunch of people Jesus said are gonna say, Well, I preached sermons in your name. I cast out demons. We did many mighty works in your name, a lifetime, a career of ministry. Yeah, he's gonna go, I don't know you. I didn't invite you here, you know. Or I didn't, you know, you're not here on here, you're here on your own merit, so depart. So that preaches, it's powerful. Yeah, um, it really is. Uh okay, we're we're running long. Are you good? But are you are you okay for like one more story? Yeah. This let's this is awesome. Let's pick it up.

SPEAKER_02: 1:04:10

Let's pick it up.

SPEAKER_06: 1:04:11

Let's let's finish fun and then we'll talk about your family. Okay. Because there's exciting stuff happening there. You're your family.

SPEAKER_03: 1:04:18

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:04:19

Not sister, mom, yes.

SPEAKER_03: 1:04:21

Like your husband and my children.

SPEAKER_06: 1:04:22

Yes. Okay.

SPEAKER_03: 1:04:24

The Tuttles. I'm no longer a Tully. I went from Tully to Tuttle.

SPEAKER_06: 1:04:27

I know. For a while, everybody called her Ann Tully Tuttle.

SPEAKER_01: 1:04:29

Antully Tully.

SPEAKER_03: 1:04:30

Well, that's what that's what my email is. That's what I signed my name ask. I can't let go of Tully. Ann Tully is my name.

SPEAKER_06: 1:04:36

It was uh for so long, everybody. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 1:04:41

She was an old soul. Everybody called her grandma. I was 23 and they're calling me grandma grandma Tully.

SPEAKER_06: 1:04:46

But it's because what I was gonna say before before we turn to this fun story, the last thing I want to say about that is you're the first person I ever saw love a person well who in a strained relationship like that. I feel like people they either further enable a person, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_04: 1:05:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:05:07

Or they just distance themselves. And you're the first person I saw who you stayed close to your mom, you loved her, you cared for, but you kept kept those healthy boundaries and and uh you didn't enable her.

SPEAKER_04: 1:05:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:05:22

You called it what it was, she never questioned your love for her. That's true. You're the first person I ever saw do that. And it was it was meaningful to me. Wow. Because my dad had died, and I wrestle with a lot of I I go back and forth between bitterness and guilt. Because I was so angry and so mad at the way, and and I let him know it, you know. And then but we had, you know, I've shared his story on here. We had restored fellowship, but it was very brief. Um and if I would have just known I can love him from a distance and keep parameters, and um, and and that it was a similarly, you know, my dad, it was a similarly complex situation. Yeah. Um, but anyway, I appreciate that. That I'm I'm grateful for that in your life because it's really encouraging. Um, you and I had to this day what is one of my greatest, most outlandish adventures at Snowbird Wilderness South Fair.

SPEAKER_03: 1:06:16

About the horsebacking.

SPEAKER_06: 1:06:17

So in old school. Oh my gosh. So Anne's working old school.

SPEAKER_03: 1:06:21

Okay, and I am a stickler about certain things. Okay.

SPEAKER_06: 1:06:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 1:06:24

L and T, leave no trace.

SPEAKER_06: 1:06:25

Leave no trace.

SPEAKER_03: 1:06:26

You've got the yin over here and the yang over there. Bro's like, pour that grease, pour that grease in the water. I'm like, what are you doing?

SPEAKER_06: 1:06:34

What the fish got to eat too. Okay, so so old school. Old school, like you start the semester, students would would show up, check in, they get their equipment, and it was like a two-week backpacking section, a 10-day wilderness first responder course, uh a uh seven, eight, nine-day uh swiftwater rescue and whitewater guiding training. Uh the trip in the Everglades was a week. It was it was just section, section, a climbing section. It was a semester long. That was crazy. It was literally a semester of once-in-a-lifetime experiences.

SPEAKER_02: 1:07:10

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_06: 1:07:11

I Little and I led a section. It was horsepacking. So it wasn't like you go out horseback riding. It was we load up horses. I would have two pack horses with these big gear paddles, uh, gear saddles with these panny panniers on it, like uh um like with food and supplies, and we would ride horses for for several days in the smokies.

SPEAKER_03: 1:07:34

Yep. And so that was the girls, and then the boys went sailing.

SPEAKER_06: 1:07:37

The boys would go sailing and we would take the girls horsepacking. There was one section we s separated the boys and the girls. And so Little had Little and I had always led that section together. And um and but our kids would come with us, and what we would do is we would pack in on horses, everybody's on horses. We would pack into a base camp, set up base camp, and then uh little would run camp, and each day I would take the the girls and we would do a big loop somewhere. We'd ride the horses out, okay? Um on that particular trip. The previous year we rode, we would ride, stop, set up camp. The next day, load up, ride, stop, set up camp, and we do a big loop like that. Um so on this trip, Anne was it was me and Ann. We're gonna take the girls out for a ride. We rode in the first day, we set up base camp, got the horses squared away. Anne knows nothing about it.

SPEAKER_03: 1:08:35

Yeah, this is the second time ever I was on a horse. The first time was when I was a camper and we did some sort of horse like in a in a corral and just go around in circles or something. I don't know. Maybe we did well as a camper, we did something with horses. So that was the first time, and this is the second time, and now I'm like a a leader of the section oh my gosh, of this massive animal. Which I'm like, I know horses can sense here. I am not afraid. I was like, oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_06: 1:09:01

I'll tell you this. It was the in my career. It was there was a couple of moments on this trip that were the sketchiest, scaredest I've ever been.

SPEAKER_03: 1:09:10

Like getting the horses around that down log on the edge of that drop off.

SPEAKER_06: 1:09:14

So what happened is we go in, we set up base camp. I roll out, so that evening, little's preparing supper. Um, I'm I'd do a session. I don't know if you remember this, but where we would base camp, I would do that trip every year. There was an old cemetery in the park up on a hill, and would take everyone up, and we would do the session in that cemetery because there's these 200-year-old headstones. And this was an old community in the mountains, and we would talk about the brevity of life, and I would teach, come back down, have supper. Um, I roll a map of the park out, and I said, What let's let's look at some ride options tomorrow. And Anne missadventure, which you don't ever want to tell me, let's do this, or you won't do that. Yeah. And she's like, I so we got the map rolled out, and if I remember, this is my perspective.

SPEAKER_03: 1:10:01

I don't remember, yeah. You tell me.

SPEAKER_06: 1:10:03

I said, Okay, here's where we are. This is this is Fourny Ridge, this is Fourny Creek, this is Hazel Creek, this is Eagle Creek, this is and but but we can do a loop here, here, here. And I said, now this is Klingman's Dome, it's the highest point in the park. And Ann said, we should ride up there, and I said, Okay, okay, well, you can only ride horses on certain designated trails in the park, and you do not ride a horse in a day from where we were to Klingman's Dome and back. Like, you don't, you're not gonna do that. And I was like, let's do it. I remember looking at Ann, I was like, That's the funny and I'm like, you don't do it? And she's like, Yeah. And it's like, yeah, and a couple of people were like, uh, a couple of the students were like, I don't know about this. I was like, let's do it. Well, we start riding, and I mean, we don't make it. We have breakfast that next morning, and we start riding. I my guesstimation we rode about 25 miles that day.

SPEAKER_04: 1:10:57

Okay.

SPEAKER_06: 1:10:58

But the the first largest portion of it was we climbed, I mean, we started at down near Fontana.

SPEAKER_03: 1:11:06

Okay.

SPEAKER_06: 1:11:06

And Klingman's Dome 6,000 feet. We started at 2,500 feet.

SPEAKER_03: 1:11:10

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_06: 1:11:11

With 3,500 feet of elevation gain.

SPEAKER_01: 1:11:14

I was just about to say so.

SPEAKER_06: 1:11:16

But they're mountain horses. I I'm not worried about the horses. I know how to take care of horses. Yes. So I fed them good. I I I gassed them up that day, I fueled them up that morning, but we start going up these trails, and then we're at the end of where you can ride horses, and now we're gonna hit foot foot trails only, designated foot traffic. And I was like, okay, guys, well, I'm gonna, if we get caught, I'll get the ticket. It's like 200 at the time, 275 bucks a pop for having horses on these trails. And we start pulling, I'd never been in that part of the park, and so we turn, we turn.

SPEAKER_04: 1:11:48

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_06: 1:11:49

And when we turn, I don't realize it, but about a mile in, there's no turning back because we're switchback climbing up this section of the park. And I'll let you tell this part of the experience.

SPEAKER_03: 1:12:00

No, what?

SPEAKER_06: 1:12:01

The with the downed yeah, when we're trying we cross that scree field.

SPEAKER_03: 1:12:05

Yes, oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_06: 1:12:07

We get to a point where it's this steep, so it's 600 feet down this ravine. These girls have never been on horses.

SPEAKER_03: 1:12:14

And and they're not one of them, maybe not the fittest at all. Like awkward in their body.

SPEAKER_06: 1:12:21

Yep.

SPEAKER_03: 1:12:21

So you have that.

SPEAKER_06: 1:12:22

And the other one not fit emotionally. Yes, is crying, whimpering, squalling.

SPEAKER_03: 1:12:28

And I am like, these horses, they can they can sense fear. I'm not, I'm not afraid, right? And but we're like, yeah, the Screfield component of it was the other added. I forgot about that. Because you're like, no, not only are you on the side of this hill, you've got rock underneath you, this massive animal. And then you've got obstacles, and you've got people who don't know what they're doing, and people who are uncomfortable in their bodies and mentally not with it.

SPEAKER_06: 1:12:50

It's not good.

SPEAKER_03: 1:12:50

No, so we had you had to take the saddles off of we crow.

SPEAKER_06: 1:12:54

Well, first we crossed the scree field. I said, Okay, everybody, we've got to ride across this. You can see it. It's about a 50-yard span. You know, it's this steep and it's a little bitty trail. And I said, Everybody take your feet out of the stirrups.

SPEAKER_04: 1:13:06

Yes.

SPEAKER_06: 1:13:06

If your horse slips, fall to the high side and sprawl out. Because I'd taken, yes, I had led rides before.

SPEAKER_01: 1:13:14

Oh, it's crazy.

SPEAKER_06: 1:13:16

But not on something like that. I had ridden stuff like that a thousand times. And you just, there's things you get ready for, like, okay, yeah. And when I cross this, if the horse falls, don't fall with it. You're dead. You're dead. You're you're dying a painful, brutal death. So if you feel the horse start slipping, jump to the high side. But the thing was, I'm not gonna let everybody walk their horse across this because if then the horse will run over you, knock you. Like you can't, I don't want those girls walking. Yes, because it's a cliff.

SPEAKER_03: 1:13:46

Yes.

SPEAKER_06: 1:13:47

And so I said, All right, I'm here's I don't remember if I had you go first and I came last, but I had a good horse out front, a good horse in the back. And my horse, man, he was like a mountain horse. I'd raise, I've still got him. I've raised that horse. He I'll trust him to go in the mountains like that. And we get through, and the last person just clears the scree field, and we're in the end of the timber, and there's a tree, a big hemlock tree is falling across the trail. We can't go. So we're out of the, you know what scree is? It's like rock, shale rock. It would be like there's no trees, it's like sandy rock. Yeah, like you'll have long stretches of just flat rock and then dust and sand. And so it's like a cliff. Imagine a rock cliff that's then about this angle. And there's a ledge cut into it that people walk, yeah, and it keeps going. It's probably 600 feet down. So it's super slippery. And and so we get across it, now we're off the scree and we're into the woods, the trees. We're up in the tree line, but now so there's trees. So now I'm not worried about somebody falling because there's trees all around us, but it's just as steep, but we I ain't going back. We cannot go back. That's not an option. And it's trees down, so I get the last person is almost out. It just makes it into the woods, and the horses start freaking out. They're getting nervous.

SPEAKER_04: 1:15:09

Yep, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:15:10

So we get we I get everybody off. I'm like, everybody get on the high side.

SPEAKER_04: 1:15:14

Yep.

SPEAKER_06: 1:15:15

So everybody's just waiting. And so I take the first saddle off, and and Anne is just kind of like, okay, tell me what to do. Yeah. We're just working together. And the horses, some of them were small enough to go under the tree because the tree, like the trails here, the tree had fallen like this, but none of them could fit with a saddle.

SPEAKER_04: 1:15:34

Yep.

SPEAKER_06: 1:15:35

They had to work to get under and scrape their backs to get under the tree.

SPEAKER_03: 1:15:40

That was wild. Poor Brody.

SPEAKER_06: 1:15:42

And we got so I unsaddle eight horses or whatever.

SPEAKER_03: 1:15:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:15:45

Get all the saddles. I walk the saddles through and stage them behind trees. I come back in one horse at a time. I get them under this log, and it was not easy. Some of them were freaking out a little bit.

SPEAKER_04: 1:15:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:15:56

Get them all through. And I'm like, we cannot go back. Because like the best thing to do would have been, we should just go back. So we we end up, we get them all under the tree, get them all over there, get them saddled, and that one girl was like, I'm not riding anymore. She she refused to she's like, I'm gonna walk, which is gonna hold us up. Yeah, it slows the whole thing down, and we just do this for the next four hours and come up into so Clinkman's Dome is like very commercial. So there's like tour buses of people there, Japanese people, European people, people from New York, people from Mexico, like the world, because it's October peak leap season. So there's so many people, and we're and we are illegal. We're riding these horses up through Klingman's Dome, like like up into the parking lot, and people like everybody's taking pictures, so like they think this is part of the show, you know. And then we get to, I don't know if you remember this, we get into the Klingman's Dome parking lot where you park to walk up to the dome, which is uh about a mile half mile height. There's an observation deck. So we come in, these trails come up into the parking lot, and I'm like, okay, if I know about a mile or two down this, the main paved highway, which in the national park, it is illegal to have horses on paved roads.$275 a pot. And I said, we got to ride down this paved road, and somewhere there's a there's a I know there's a trail that'll go into the head of Mill Creek or Nolan Creek. Like, we just gotta look for it. So we're riding. We ride for two miles on the paved road, traffic, cars, not one park ranger comes by by God's grace, and we get back into the trees. And I remember we we ride now, now I'm comfortable, I'm like, okay, I know where I'm at. We get back in the mountains. I'm like, I'm good. I'll get us home, I'll get us back to camp. We've made this big, huge, massive 25-mile loop through the mountains. And I remember it gets dark on us. Yeah, the last probably 30 minutes we're in pitch black. But right before it got dark, I see a pretty big boar black bear off down in the creek. The horses start getting nervous. And I'm like, if these girls see that bear, if these horses freak out, these girls see that bear, we are done. And they didn't nobody saw it. I don't think I even told you.

SPEAKER_03: 1:18:14

No, I don't, yeah. I was like that's crazy. It was really crazy. I'm glad you recounted all those details. I do remember the down tree. I don't remember the conversation about Klingon's dome, like making having that, like the planning it out, but I believe it.

SPEAKER_06: 1:18:30

Well, all it was was you want to do that? I've never and you're like, Yeah, let's do it. And that's that was the conversation.

SPEAKER_03: 1:18:36

That was so funny. But I do remember, yeah, and then I remember the latter part, like when we were finally like towards the latter part getting back towards camp, and it it was definitely like we had already weathered the wackiness of it all. We're like, this is actually fun. And I think we got a little bit of speed, you know. Um, but I remember when we were leaving the next day, the next day, and like a bag or something fell off, and you know, and I'm like, again, the leave no trace in me. You know, you're like, porn grease over here. We left some gear, we're like, whatever. I mean, we it was a trip.

SPEAKER_06: 1:19:08

We were like, let's get back.

SPEAKER_03: 1:19:10

Yes, he was like, I don't know. Who cares what's in that bag? We're not going back. It's done.

SPEAKER_06: 1:19:16

Because when we were trying to get everybody mounted and out of camp, that was the last day we were heading out that day.

SPEAKER_03: 1:19:22

Oh man.

SPEAKER_06: 1:19:23

And uh, and one girl got bucked off. I don't remember what happened. That girl you're talking about that couldn't really control her body. She her horse freaked out. I don't remember what happened now, but she ended up getting bucked off. She was okay. And I was like, we got to get moving.

SPEAKER_05: 1:19:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:19:37

When you horses, when you get them all mounted and saddled and lined up, they get antsy if they know they're getting ready to move.

SPEAKER_04: 1:19:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:19:44

And they were getting real antsy. And I'm, but I'm trying to get everybody. And Ann was awesome because she didn't know what she's doing, but she's game, you know. So we're trying to get everybody mounted and on their horse, and we got to get moving. And I've got, I mean, I got my two kids, two or three kids. I don't remember if Laylee was with us, I don't remember what year that was, but they're competent. My kids could ride. Yeah. Like I skate my kids on their horses. Yeah. Little's got two pack horses. I got two pack horses, and we got to get moving. And we get about a mile down the trail, and Ann's like, oh, I think we left. We had left something. No, something pretty substantial.

SPEAKER_03: 1:20:16

Yes, some sort of gear. It was like important. And I was like, I don't care. Yeah, we're on. One, he was the boss man. I was like, whatever. You have to talk to Harry about it.

SPEAKER_06: 1:20:25

I was like, I was like, uh because we were like certified Leave No Trace organization.

SPEAKER_03: 1:20:30

Yes. And I quit pouring the grease in the creek. You and Little, you and Little together. I was like, y'all have not read them, you have not read the manual.

SPEAKER_06: 1:20:38

No, we have not, and I still haven't.

SPEAKER_01: 1:20:40

Little doesn't know what leave no trace.

SPEAKER_06: 1:20:43

And because I grew up in those mountains. Yes. Frying bacon and biscuits. And you know, they're showing up with like these dehydrated meals. And I'm like, so the first night, though, we roll in. I've got we've got three horses with four, each one of them has two big paddle like boxes on the saddle. Steak, potatoes, like steak, potatoes, onions. Yeah. They've been eating dehydrated food the whole semester. And we feasted that person out there.

SPEAKER_03: 1:21:10

Yeah, but it was awesome. Oh, there's a yep.

SPEAKER_06: 1:21:13

So fun.

SPEAKER_03: 1:21:14

So fun.

SPEAKER_06: 1:21:15

Um, all right. So, yeah, so Antully is part of some of my most memorable, high, low, hard, funny experiences. Nobody, probably nobody that's served in this ministry that I have the same set of experiences that I have with Ann. Um, okay. Uh life today.

SPEAKER_03: 1:21:36

Yeah. I live in Marietta.

SPEAKER_06: 1:21:38

Let's wrap it up that way. So you're in Marietta, Georgia.

SPEAKER_03: 1:21:41

I live in Marietta, Georgia. Um, yeah, I moved down that area in 2015 from here down there. Hunter and I have been married, and this October will be 10 years. We got married on the Hela River.

SPEAKER_06: 1:21:53

Got a picture of me and Tuck.

SPEAKER_03: 1:21:54

Yep. At your wedding. Yeah, it was a beautiful day, October 25th. It was peak leaf season. It was really special.

SPEAKER_06: 1:22:00

They got married on the little island at Mystic Rivers.

SPEAKER_01: 1:22:03

Oh, really? Well, I've heard this. After you guys got married, did you get in a boat and then go down the river? No, we came up with someone else.

SPEAKER_06: 1:22:10

Urban urban legend.

SPEAKER_03: 1:22:11

Urban legend. Real story is we left, got an argument about who where my cell phone was, had to turn around. It's like, here's real life. Left in our Buickle Saber, whatever. Um, no, but 10 years we've been married. But yeah, Hunter and I met in 2011. He was on staff. I was here full time. It was really pretty funny because Steph Gatton was on staff at that point, and we would pray over the new incoming staff we didn't know. She'd print off pictures, and so we'd see everyone that we didn't know have but be familiar with their faces. And I remember they were calling me grandma tully.

SPEAKER_06: 1:22:43

We still do that, by the way.

SPEAKER_03: 1:22:44

Yeah. So um, I uh I walk in and Steph's like, look at this this profile. I mean, this guy is in a kayak, you know, he's older. He I was 25. Um, no, I was 26, he was 25. Anyway, hey, outdoorsy, cool. His last name's Tuttle.

SPEAKER_06: 1:23:02

Had been in the military years.

SPEAKER_03: 1:23:04

Yep, yep. Now he's a student at Brevard College, and he was friends with Kaufman, Brian Kaufman, and that was the connection point. And uh anyway, just outdoorsy, older, cool. I was like, oh, cool. I bet he's shorter than me. I was trying to quote guard my heart. How taller you I'm almost six foot, if not there. And he's like, I think he's five'eight. Um, it doesn't feel that big of a difference, but anyway, so I was like, he's probably shorter than me. And I left. Well, I knew who he was when he came to, you know, the orientation weekend. And um, I don't know. It was really funny because he was new to the faith. He was definitely guarding his heart. He was like not interested in talking to any of the girls. And uh he always talks about when um the guys had the talk during staff training, you're talking to him, like, you're not gonna ignore half of the body of Christ, you know. He's like, dang, does Brody like see into my heart right now? You know, like sort of deal. So he was challenged by that, but it was also just a good boundary for him. But I um had a house on Healy Fields and I would invite people over on the weekends because I love to cook and host people, and I know what it's like to be in the summer. Sure. And this, you know, have a place to go. Um, and I was always um, I was just intentional with being friends with Hunter. Uh so I'd invite him and other people. He, you know, he's not gonna turn down a meal. Like he is a dude. He's like free food, let's do it. Anyway, so we just end up building a friendship with him um through that summer. And really, I mean, he lived above reproach. I would say Hunter, he's just a man of integrity. And so that was um 2011. I introduced him to my youth pastor, Joe Strange, because Hunter done Iron Mans, Joe would do Iron Man's. I was just like, just being intentional with making some connections. I wasn't one of those things where I was like, saw him from a distance. I was like, one day I hope he notices me. I was like, nah, like we can become friends, right? I mean, I desired to have a husband one day, but also had been through a plethora of different experiences through my time at Snowbird and through college, where it's like, you know, anyway, just proceed with wisdom. And so we became friends, but it was one of those things where we had different connections. Well, then in 2012, on the PCT, Spencer asked if I would co-lead the old school semester. I was like, absolutely. And then I found out Hunter was leading, co-leading too. And I was like, Oh yeah, absolutely. And Spence made sure to let me know that we were not allowed, like, you know, no connections there. I was like, whatever, I'm excited. The Lord just kind of put it all together. And we had some really interesting, because I was outdoors woman. Like, I was confident had been a hiker, been a part of the ministry for a long time. So I'd go out there and be a point person. Well, then you have Hunter, who went to school for outdoor experiential education.

SPEAKER_06: 1:25:45

So he's been like the class academic side, academic side of it.

SPEAKER_03: 1:25:50

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_06: 1:25:50

He hadn't been uh on a horsepacking trip to clean this dome, dumping dumping bacon grease in the meal crew.

SPEAKER_03: 1:25:55

No, no, but he was confident and he's very confident in that space, which I'd never been matched with that in the outdoor, in that, in that arena. And it was really cool because we had a couple of like clashing moments, but he but he took the lead. We sat and talked about and every and then we had conflict resolution and we were better for it, which was a really cool, refreshing type of interaction. That happened at least three, maybe four times that whole semester. But it was cool because it didn't like push each other away, we just got closer. So then anyway, it was again, it was like I said, it was a super that was 2012, um, slow burn. We're just friends, and then in 2014, November 2014, I had hiked the CDT that year. He had gone to um Tanzania and climbed Kilimanjaro, and then he went to India with a third. Yep, yep, yep, to teach wilderness first aid and just be in the be in the villages there and um okay, pause. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:26:51

Josh Haskell, when we interviewed him two weeks ago for that episode, and I talked about the video we have of Josh and his partner on that trip sharing the gospel with that group of men. It was Hunter.

SPEAKER_01: 1:27:03

Oh, cool.

SPEAKER_06: 1:27:04

It was Josh and Hunter.

SPEAKER_01: 1:27:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:27:05

So Ann's husband Hunter did one of our early trips. We ran several early trips to the Himalayas to Northern India up in Ladakh. And so Hunter and Josh were on that trip together.

SPEAKER_03: 1:27:17

That's cool. Yeah. So and then 2014, no, November 2014, I got back. We were we went on a, we went to the Hunter and I went to the Smokies to do a like a trail maintenance trip. Anyway, we had had a conversation in April of that year where I'm like, we're friend. I mean, I'm 29 years old at this point. I'm like, we're friends, but what are we doing? Anyway, the Lord, the Lord worked at where it's a pause, but in November 2014 is when he's like, you said something. You said um we uh oh we're friends with like we look like we're in a relationship without with a without a commitment sort of deal. Like we're just really trying, you know, enjoyed each other's company. But anyway, so then in you know, November he said, you know, you're worth making that commitment to. And I remember we were in the shelter in the smokies, and I because I either knew our friendship is either over, like we're done, like we're never gonna talk to each other again, or we're gonna be in a relationship. And I was just stone cold, like waiting to hear what he was gonna say. And he said, You're worth making a commitment to. And in my dorkiness, I'm sitting there in the dark and I go like this, ooh, ooh, ooh, that was my response.

SPEAKER_06: 1:28:22

That's funny.

SPEAKER_03: 1:28:23

I was like, whoo, that was such a hard summer. You know, I was hiking and I was like just waiting to see what would happen, anyhow. And so then we got married nine um 11 months later. Um, but yeah, I moved to Marietta in February of 2015 from here. Um, lived with a friend, and we just, you know, figured it out. And then we lived with some of his friends for a year and then we bought our house. Um, we've been there since November of 2016. We're part of um a really wonderful church, Stonebridge. Um JB has connections to that church, which is really cool. And um, yeah, he was a fireman for a long time. It's been a year since he left the fire department with Cobb County. And uh now we have a lawn business. He's doing that full, full force, I guess the long care of Marietta, which has been a really cool thing to see his entrepreneurial, you know, pursuits come to fruition and us building a business together and seeing what the Lord has from that, especially since both he and I came from kind of meager means, and just kind of navigate like, what does the Lord have for us and not just being limited by our former experiences, but seeing like, what does the Lord have for us and for our children? And so being a part of that, but um, yeah, we lost our first baby at 16 weeks. Um, we named that baby Tully Jesse Tuttle, which means peaceful gift from God back to God, Jehovah's Real. So that was in 2018, February 2018. And then a few months later, I got pregnant with Wilder. Wilder Boone means wild blessing. And um, he's six and a half now and awesome. We have Acre Bryce and uh, and then we have Tulula, Talula Jane. She's awesome. She's so Acre's four and a half, and Talula is almost 20 months old. And then we have another baby. I'm 11 weeks pregnant. It is exciting because I would never have executed on that. But again, like throughout this whole time, like this, God is so much bigger than me. He is working a bigger picture than just my understanding. And I'm and like hinging on the reality of like if I don't, I have to believe who God is. Otherwise, there's no way it would make no sense for me to have another child. But the Lord's like, I'm doing a new work. And this is part of it. And like there's a true excitement that couples with that. So we're just living a just a simple but yet complicated life. I'm in the thick of raising little babies and trying to get my house in order and being faithful to the community that's there. I've been surrounded by a great group of people. I mean, family that live down there. And um it's a really wonderful. I mean, my life looks nothing like I thought it would, but I'm not sure what I thought it would look like. It's so much sweeter. And my life experiences have been just really rich. And so I'm like, here we are. I thought in my 40s we'd get back into doing run races and stuff.

unknown: 1:31:02

Nope.

SPEAKER_06: 1:31:03

I was like just pregnant.

SPEAKER_03: 1:31:04

Just pregnant. Yeah. And so I'm like, okay, and do time, you know, do time. I don't know.

SPEAKER_06: 1:31:09

So I forgot about I forgot about the running piece. Yeah. Yeah, you did.

SPEAKER_03: 1:31:14

Yeah, I did an Iron Man a week before I got married. Well, I forgot about that. Yep. Yeah, it was one of those things. I'd made the goal. I'm like, when I'm 30, I'm gonna do an Iron Man. Just happened. It happened, everything happened where I'm like, well, the Iron Man Wilmington is a week before I get married. And so on my wedding pictures, I have this really sweet razor back Tamline.

SPEAKER_06: 1:31:32

Anne was Anne's one of those people. If she says she's gonna do something, I believe her.

SPEAKER_03: 1:31:36

Yeah. This is funny. Yeah, well, thank you. It's also one of those things where for better or for worse, I remember when during strap staff training we had the climbing tower and blue was blaying me because I was real selective on who was gonna belay me. I got there's the you know mechanisms and all that, but I'm not a light girl. They call me a triple deuce diesel. That's because I weighed 222 pounds. One day I'll get back there. The glory days. The glory days. The glory days. But so I'm like, I'm selective of who's gonna be belaying me. And blue is bigger than me. So I was like, you can belay me, blue. Anyway, I'll get almost to the top of the climbing tower. And I'm like, Blue, I'm done. I'm done. I don't want to go anymore. I'm tired, I'm done. He said, I'll let you down, Ann Tully, if you say, My name is Ann Tully and I'm a quitter. Oh, I was not saying that. So I got my tail all the way at the top, but Blue knew he had my number dialed. And it was it's just such a very distinct type of like, yeah, that is my personality.

SPEAKER_06: 1:32:32

Yeah, if you want Ann to do something, tell her she can't do it or won't do it.

SPEAKER_03: 1:32:35

It's true. And I believe I know that about myself, and yet it still works. It's a tactic that because I we live in a 1,200 square foot home right now, and it's small. We have one bathroom. And every time people find out that we're pregnant with our fourth baby, they're like, You're gonna have to move, right? And Hunter said to me the other day, I'm like, it's all about perspective. You make it work. Hunter said, You would stay in this house just to prove prove people wrong, wouldn't you? I was like, not intentionally, but I think you're right. Now that you said it, yeah, now that I think about it, yes. Yeah, actually. So, anyhow, yeah, but so we're just until they quit talking about it.

SPEAKER_06: 1:33:10

Then we can move up.

SPEAKER_03: 1:33:11

It's true. I know. My face says it all, and people know me anyway.

unknown: 1:33:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:33:17

Hey, thanks.

SPEAKER_03: 1:33:18

Thank you. It's been such a pleasure.

SPEAKER_06: 1:33:21

It was a long time making it happen. Yeah, you made it happen.

SPEAKER_03: 1:33:25

Well, thanks for watching.

SPEAKER_06: 1:33:26

You're the one that had to load your three little ones up and come. Hopefully, hopefully, so three hours of work here. Hopefully, the rest of your time here will be enjoyable. Yes, it is to see some folks and do some things.

SPEAKER_03: 1:33:38

And before you know it, uh at least Wilder be coming up for I yeah, Jessica Hoover keeps putting in the Facebook SWO Facebook like it and crews come, and I'm like, one of these days, while I mean, soon before I know it, Wilder's gonna be in sixth grade. Oh, yeah, being a part of it, and that full circle will be really neat. And maybe one of these days I'll come work another summer. That'd be cool. I would love it.

SPEAKER_06: 1:33:58

That'd be so cool.

SPEAKER_03: 1:33:59

Get up in the morning, go send the metal building. I don't have people to still do that. Drink that gross coffee.

SPEAKER_06: 1:34:04

Andy has made a promise. Oh, yeah. When the Pepsi contract runs out, we're gonna have good coffee. We got another year and a half. Oh, wow. And he said from then on, we'll have good coffee.

SPEAKER_03: 1:34:13

Let's go.

SPEAKER_06: 1:34:14

I know the whole camera crew is all like, thank the Lord.

SPEAKER_01: 1:34:19

I mean, it it makes do, but oh yeah, I turned down the days.

SPEAKER_03: 1:34:23

Yes. Oh my gosh. Yeah. Well, thanks again.

SPEAKER_06: 1:34:27

You are loved here by a lot of people. Thanks. And we're just we're grateful. And I'm I'm very grateful. Like I said, your life is a trophy life to me. Again, on context, not my trophy. It's a gospel trophy on display. Like to see what God can do. Sometimes He just shows off and He does it through a person's life. And I love it. It's awesome.

SPEAKER_03: 1:34:49

Thank you.

SPEAKER_06: 1:34:49

We've been through a lot.

SPEAKER_03: 1:34:50

Yes, we have. Let's keep it. I know. Yes, yeah. For real. Yeah. Yeah. It's still going. Awesome. All right. Well, thank you guys. Of course.

SPEAKER_01: 1:34:58

All right, y'all. That wraps up the part two of the Anne episodes and her story. I hope you guys were encouraged by her story. It's hard not to be. Uh, she is truly one of the most awesome ladies I've ever met. And even just listening to her story, there are multiple times where I was feeling convicted and just encouraged and truly just in awe of her and her faithfulness to the Lord and how the Lord has used her. She's awesome. I hope really hope you guys were um encouraged and were able to glean something from this episode. Um, I hope you guys have been enjoying all of these interviews. Um, I know normally we'll sprinkle in some interviews here and there, but uh, we've been in a really cool season where we've just been able to interview literally the coolest people ever. And I'm not even just saying that. Like it's been so awesome to just sit in and listen to these interviews and being able to engage with these people, and they're awesome. Um, but we do have some future content coming up, more beyond the flannel graph type of content, which if you're unfamiliar, that's just um when Brody will normally take a Bible story or um that sounded so Sunday school, a Bible story, um, a story from the Bible, or um just a chunk of scripture and just kind of explain it and exposite it and um uh really dig deep into it and kind of explain it. Um really cool content. So we got some of that coming up. Um and we also have a few more interviews, um, which are so cool. Um, we are interviewing Clay Hicks, he's coming up for the marriage conference, and we're interviewing him. Um, he is awesome, his family is awesome. We really appreciate him and his family coming up and being willing to be interviewed. And then um a few weeks ago we interviewed a young lady named Gwen who also just has a crazy story, and she is just so well articulated and just loved hearing her and talking with her. You guys are definitely in for a treat with all of the upcoming content. Um, but as always, thank you guys so much for listening and thank you so much for tuning in. Uh, really hope you guys have been enjoying this type of content and look forward to more content to come. Um, thank you guys so much for listening, and we'll see you next week on No Sanity Required.

SPEAKER_00: 1:37:16

Thanks for listening to No Sanity Required. Please take a moment to subscribe and leave a rating. It really helps. Visit us at swooutfitters.com to see all of our programming and resources. We'll see you next week on No Sanity Required.